Swing keel/daggerboard?

filmsomething · Post by **filmsomething** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 3:47 pm

I'm trying to find out if the 7.9 has a swing keel or daggerboard(slides down and does not pivot, making hitting rocks or sand bars bad news)

I'm just trying ti figure out if I want a 7.9 or an 8.0

thanks,
Jon

filmsomething · Post by **filmsomething** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 6:52 am

no one?

dave · Post by **dave** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:09 am

It just seems like a strange question, but that's just me. Most of the 7.9s were built with a daggerboard. Some are fixed keel. NONE have ever been made with a swing keel.

filmsomething · Post by **filmsomething** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:48 am

Well I'm just trying to make sure I'm thinking of the correct idea of a daggerboard, when I think of a daggerboard it makes me think of my old sunfish with a wood board that went straight up and down in a slot. If it is the same concept with the 7.9 then it would make me a little worried about grounding the board because then it would be ripping against the hull vs. with a swing keel or centerboard setup they would just swing out of the way.

Jon

Jeffrey · Post by **Jeffrey** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:57 am

No matter which boat you choose you will find these boats very well made. The Dagger board is quite an advantage when trailering, and can be removed for repairs, which is faily easy to do.

The difference in the boats is mainly how you want to use it. The 8.0 is more cruiser designed (head room below decks) and the 7.9, though comfortable below, is more like camping on board, but was made more for racing/cruising.

The 7.9 has a strong, active class, and you can find 8.0 forums as well, but no active class.

There are a lot of 7.9ers that would welcome you to jump on board for a sail! Good luck! Jeff (Skyhawk #250)

filmsomething · Post by **filmsomething** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:46 am

Thanks Jeff, I plan to start getting into more cruising(mostly great lakes) and I think the Mrs. would like the more comfortable setup the 8.0 has.

I have heard a rumor that some of the S2s had the wet deck problem, would any of you know if the 8.0 is one of them? I will search out a decent 8.0 forum.

dave · Post by **dave** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:55 pm

filmsomething, any boat ever built in which balsa core was used has wetdeck problems if they get old enough and are not cared for and monitored for water intrusion around any and all deck fittings. I have seen as many "J's" that had as bad a problem with it as any other make. Tillotson Pearson made/makes lots of $$$$$$$ boats, and they all WILL have this problem over time, some very little and some a whole lot. It's one of the trade offs when using balsa core. It's has the highest strength and stiffness to weight ratio of any core out there and excellent adhesion to the fiberglass skins, and it's the cheapest too. If you own or are thinking of owning a boat with balsa core in the deck and/or hull, it's just one of those care/maintainence issues that MUST be taken into consideration.

filmsomething · Post by **filmsomething** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:51 pm

thanks dave, yeah I know most with balsal have issues after time I just didn't know if they had anything special I should look for when looking at them.

dave · Post by **dave** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:38 pm

The same as all other boats. The chainplates and especially the highly loaded areas where the loads break the factory seal on the caulking and/or causes compression in the core. The footblocks aft of the winches, the winches [both sets] and the aft end of the Genoa track, and the mast step come to mind but like I said, any and all through core fittings can and will leak over time. There is plywood under the winches and traveler track. Still leaks and rots, etc, so on, and so forth.

BarryE · Post by **BarryE** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:01 pm

The S2 7.9 came in two versions, dagger board, and fixed keel. Most of them (over 500)are dagger board boats, only a handful (less than 20)of fixed keel types were built, primarily for competition under the old MORC rules. The 7.9 was designed by Graham and Schlageter out of Chicago. (the origins of the G & S; "Grand Slam" moniker used by S2.)
The 8.0, also known as the S2 26, was designed by Arthur Edmonds, and was designed primarily as a more comfortable cruising type boat.
I've had the good and bad fortune to sail on all versions of the above mentioned boats.
The 8.0/26 came in several versions, an aft cockpit version, a center cockpit version, a deep keel version, and a shoal keel version. The best sailing version is the aft cockpit version with the deep keel. The worst is the center cockpit version with the shoal keel.
In building the center cockpit version S2 raised the deckline by several inches, and placed the center cockpit in a kind of mid-deck bunker that raised the boat even higher. The end result was a lot of windage up high, and a higher center of gravity. Combined with the shoal keel, the boat gave considerable leeway when attempting to sail to windward. Atomic 4 gas inboard was standard on these boats.
The more traditonal aft cockpit version, with a deep keel is a decent performer on par with most other boats of that type and vintage, similar to a Catalina 27, Columbia 26, etc.
The hull and deck of the S2 7.9 are balsa cored, and yes, that requires careful maintenance, and inspection. The 8.0/26 have a solid glass hull, but I don't remember whether the deck is cored or not.
The 7.9 is 9' wide but sits low on a trailer and is easy to launch, the 8.0/26 is only 8' wide, and only the shoal version is ramp launchable.
In terms of comfort, the center cockpit version is the most comfortable, the aft cockpit version is next, and the S2 7.9 comes in a close third, due to lower head room, and the intrusive centerboard trunk in the middle.
As for the 7.9 and running aground; yes, it is posssible to damage the board if you hit too hard, the board gets pushed back into the rear of the trunk, and sometimes this takes a bite out of the upper rear of the board. I don't know of anyone who has actually suffered hull damage by running aground though I suppose it is possible.
One last thing, if you are into racing at all, the 7.9 is considerably faster on all points than any version of the 8.0/26.
Hope this helps.

grandillusion · Post by **grandillusion** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:40 pm

the 7.9 is THE BEST trailerable sailboat of it's size! and I might add one of the largest one can launch at most ramps an still sail like a FK, you couldn't drag me from mine that I baught just last year!

dave · Post by **dave** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:51 pm

IMHO, grand illusion is pretty accurate in his assessment. I do wish that the boat had been designed and built lighter, but it's still a very good machine if you have the vehicle and the gas $$$ to pull it. Not having to rely on a crane for the mast and/or launching the boat is a HUGE plus!