Rail stanchions

[normbue]

Whats the best way to repair the deck at the rail stanchions. I have a couple that were a little soft, now one a broke down thru the deck, on the inboard side. When I saw they were soft, I put some bigger backing blocks on the inside to keep them from pulling out. Never thought they would go in. GuessI could put blocks on the deck, but that would be tacky

[SailingUphill]

Your bigger issue is to get the core repaired... given that the stanchion has gone all the way through for you, you likely now have to peel all that skin back and replace the rotted core. I think you'll be at least 8-10 inches around it (maybe not)...

but you can cover up the mess (work from the bottom if you can)... from the top like they did here.. I don't think it looks horrible.

[AJ Oliver]

Yes, work from below if you can. Search for "wet core" on the "Repair, parts & Maint."
Lots of advice there . .

[normbue]

Thanks, Its what I suspected. I was just hoping for something easier. But I guess not. Makes you wonder why they didn't make those areas solid in the first place. Did you make those base plates? Or are can they be purchased somewhere?
Thanks again.

[SailingUphill]

Norm.. just showing the work, someone else did the plates.

[normbue]

Think They would make some for me?

[SailingUphill]

Sorry I got the boat that way, figure it's just starboard though.

[AJ Oliver]

Nothing wrong with using plates both above AND below. Stanchion bases are a problem area on many boats.
I agree, though, the original build was problematic.
If the problem area is ONLY the stanchion bases, it's not too big of a job.
But it IS a pretty big job if your boat is like mine - there was wet and bad core that BEGAN at the
stanchion bases, then went up to the genoa track, back to the cockpit winch, thense to the turning block -
on both sides. But it was still worth it - love the boat.
[For cost comparison of the repair, I'd say you would be doing really well if you could get it
done for something like $ 800 per square foot. My fix was about 7 sq feet.]

[SailingUphill]

Yep, these boats aren't worth spending that kind of cash... its nearly 100% labor... so it's one of those things that you might just as well crack it open and learn it yourself (just my opinion of course).

[AJ Oliver]

If I were doing it again I would invest in the gear to do vacuum bagging.
It's very awkward to work with fiberglass cloth and epoxy when it is overhead.
With vacuum bagging you'll get fewer voids.
I hate it when I get epoxy in my beard & little remaining hair.

[dave]

AJ, I just finished a 7.9 job that included repairing the starboard aft stanchion core rot and fractured glass on the inboard side. As was mentioned, it's usually bigger than just the stanchion area on the aft stanchion, and this one had a really bad leak at the Genoa track directly inboard from there, just aft of companionway. As most of you know, this and sailmaking are what I do for a living, and your price estimate is darn tootin' close!

On the stanchions and the problem: pulling outward on them doesn't do much because as that happens the cable automatically tightens, effectively limiting the outward movement. The killer is when the boat is broached and you have what I refer to "Lifeline Pigeons" hanging on the upper/high side lifeline or top of the stanchion. That 24" lever magnifies the hell out of the actual weight being applied! The outboard stanchion bolts are in glass with all the load pulling in tension. The inboard edge is all compression and even in brand new balsa core laminate, enough force will shear right through the glass deck skin into the balsa. Old damp balsa or worse yet, compost, well........

Since all the compression force is on the inboard side, and plates mounted between the base and the deck need to extend further inboard to spread the load. Conversely, the tension on the outboard bolts is best addressed by going to a metal backup plate or large as possible SS fender washers that spread the load as far out to the gunwale as possible. The fender washers can be stacked in multiple thicknesses that will bend slightly to take on the shape beneath them yet still spread the load effectively, where one might not do. Lastly, the stock 1/4" x 20 machine screws look nice but can't be torqued very tightly. The best bet is to use the same size hex head bolts.

Lastly, if one is wanting to recaulk and retorque before any rot starts AND the balsa is still dry, take the opportunity to overdrill the inboard holes, fill with epoxy and high density filler and then redrill new holes. This not only stops any possible water intrusion into the balsa, but the epoxy/high density filler plug makes a compression strut between the two skins so that the balsa doesn't compress with each "landing off the pigeons", causing the bolts to become loose. The epoxy plug makes water intrusion moot here even if the bolts are loose or not caulked, but the continued pulling and pushing on the top of the stanchion on the stock mountings is what starts the compression of the balsa and the corresponding tearing away of the caulk on the bolt holes and around the stanchion base, which causes the water to intrude to begin with.

[Runaway]

If you don't have vacuum bagging supplies, an alternate way to keep the upside down parts in place is to use a layer of wax paper under the wetted cloth, supported by a chunk of 4 inch cushion foam. place a small piece of plywood under the foam and prop it in place using a 2X4 or 2X2. Have made quite a few deck repairs this way.

Wet out the cloth before applying it to the underside, and be careful not to use too much resin. Also, 1708 cloth is pretty good stuff, and I cut one layer of cloth to fit the size of the replacement core section and a second patch extending about an inch on all sides from the patch.

Once the resin begins to set, ( resin stops dripping) peel away the wax paper and sqweegie the patch a little to remove excess resin. I used closed cell foam "triple cut" for all my repairs which will prevent any water that gets past the stancion bolts to saturate surrounding wood core in the future -

Good Luck!

[normbue]

Not to change the subject, but if the hull was rotten, would it cause cracks in front of, and behind the centerboard trunk? And if it is, could you come down from the top by cutting out the floor and inner liner to make the repair? A racing competitor #284, has bad stanchions, and turning blocks, and now maybe the hull!

[dave]

Cracks in those areas aren't uncommon on the 7.9, but in my experience this is for some of the same reasons as the
mast step: a power boat builder making saiboats! The fore and aft areas where the trunk goes into the hull aren't beefy enough to take the forces generated by the board when sailing..... Or being let down too hard or dropped!!! I ground this out from the outside doing a fairly wide and deep tapered grind to give the new laminate plenty of depth and surface area for strength/stiffness and good bonding. Don't use polyester here!

On the thread topic: cutting glass to the same size as the balsa ain't a good idea. Any and all layers need to overlap the original glass/be larger than the balsa patch. wink:

[normbue]

OK, Thanks guys!